WA Family Violence Restraining Order

[LovingDad1973]

Yeah I'm in Perth and just walked into Joondalup magistrates court and got a copy of the affidavit there and then and the transcript was emailed 12 days later.

Not sure where you're at. My ex took out a FVRO, I had a good lawyer, my brother is a lawyer and my friend is a top criminal lawyer in Perth (she worked on the Lloyd Rayney case). All of them said the same thing, my ex has no chance of winning if it went to trial. However she offered a 5 month CAO. If I wanted to apply to have the FVRO cancelled I would have had to wait minimum 6 months, probably longer and at a cost, going to trial, even longer, 8 months plus and more money, so for me, sadly, the 5 month CAO was the best option.

This has been my frist dealing with any kind of legal stuff and I've been left gobsmacked at how unjust, archaic, ineffective and idiotic the whole FVRO process is. Bizarre. My ex was in court, lodging the FVRO for 2minutes, 9.17 - 9.19. No evidence was presented and she managed to lie 4 times in those 2 minutes. Lies that I could have easily exposed if it went to trial.... frustrating that I couldn't. On this occasion I had to roll over and accept I was beaten by my ex and beaten by the system. C'est la vie.

Hi Jimbo, thanks for the advice

I am out of the country at present but will go into the Perth Magistrates court when I get back and do this.

I am torn because on the one hand, I have no problem complying with the INTERIM FVRO because its with an ex-girlfriend and have zero reason or desire to have anything to do with her in the future. In fact an FVRO will keep her away from me.

However, on the other hand, I think that I can clearly prove that my ex-girlfriend has lied under oath.

Fact: I have an affidavit my ex-girlfriend signed in October 2018 (for my Family Court proceedings) which contradict her current allegations of drugs which she says began around July 2018 etc

Fact: I also have an affidavit my ex-girlfriend signed in December 2018 and her medical records (for the Family Court litigation around financial support she started against her ex-husband) which clearly show she had surgery planned for late April 2019 on her knee back then for a chronic long term condition. Yet she claims that she had to have surgery on her knee in May 2019 because of an assault by me in December 2018.

And thats just from what I was able to glean from what my ex-wife wrote in her affidavit

There are no threatening emails/messages from me to her and no witnesses to this imaginary assault.

Anyways once I know the details of her accusations I will be better able to make a decision.

Whatever I do I am trying to focus on whats best for the Family Court proceedings and not get emotional about the lies about my character that were used to get the INTERIM FVRO.

 

[LovingDad1973]

Thanks to everyone who has replied to this thread. Just knowing that I am not alone in having similar experiences is helpful.

When I get back to Perth I will get the details from the Magistrates Court and keep this thread updated on the outcomes of both my Family Court and INTERIM FVRO proceedings.

Hopefully my experiences might help another dad in a similar position

 

[LovingDad1973]

If a FVO (even interim) is in place, the court MUST take it into some account... I think for two reasons. Firstly if one exists they have a duty to ask questions & be satisfied that it has been given the weight it deserves in any decision. Secondly so that when orders ARE made, they can take into account any of the conditions of the existing order. Family court orders can take precedence over state issued orders...

What would be the likely consequences of accepting a Conduct Agreement Order on a without admissions basis?

Remembering that the INTERIM FVRO has been obtained by an ex-girlfriend. My ex-wife has never tried to get such an order

I want to focus on my Family Court proceedings about the only two people in this whole shambles that matter, my daughters. And I am not experienced in the Magistrates Court (unlike the Family Court).

However with the file of evidence I have against my ex-girlfriend maybe I should just defend myself against the FVRO.

Sadly I am only deterred from defending myself by the one-sidedness of the justice system against recipients of FVROs (usually men/dads). Whatever happened to 'innocent until proven guilty'

 

[LovingDad1973]

Gosh when I read what I just wrote there I scratch my head about my taste in women

 

[Atticus]

What would be the likely consequences of accepting a Conduct Agreement Order on a without admissions basis?

Remembering that the INTERIM FVRO has been obtained by an ex-girlfriend. My ex-wife has never tried to get such an order

Laws around FVRO's in WA have changed recently... The new law states that any person who applies for a FVRO MUST be granted an interim order. Ridiculous IMO... The result will be a huge backlog of cases to be heard by respondents who wish to oppose it..The COA is something that has been introduced as a way of allowing a respondent to accept without admissions & I believe differs a little from the former accepting without admissions

There seems to be a bit of conflicting opinion out there ATM whether a COA is considered a FVRO or not, at least one law firm states that a COA is specifically NOT a FVRO ( still is legally enforceable & breaches are punishable)... While legal aid states that they fall under the restraining orders act & therefore are...... You should get some solid legal opinion on that, if it is not a FVRO, that MAY mean that it doesn't have to be declared in the family court as a FVRO doe's... (again Check that with a solicitor)..

That said, the family court (federal circuit court) only states that any RELEVANT FVRO needs to be declared.. I can't see how this would be relevant to your family law case.. It's not about your ex & you have no history of FV with her that one could argue would make this FVRO relevant..

A COA can be made by the court on any terms & length of time it sees as appropriate in the circumstances... It's my understanding this can be challenged by the applicant (The terms & time that is) & a court date may be set to do that, BUT it's the COA that is in effect in the meantime not a FVRO....

 

[sammy01]

"best interests of the child"
That is it - family law in 5 words. So no accusation that the kids were exposed to violence? No accusation that you were violent to them.

Mate those magistrates are pretty smart, they're gonna see this for what it is. Frankly, I think you're on a win here even if you accept without admission.
WHY? Well clearly ex wife is pissed with how the family law stuff went. She was quick to jump on board and use this to deny access. She is not gonna win, not a chance. So she will learn quickly that she can't play games here.

I had a mate, the ex would drop the kid off sometimes . Not always. They lived 5 hours apart. Her best joke, was to wait until he'd done the 2 1/2 drive to the meeting point then call and say NOT COMING.... So He'd done the drive for nothing... He would pay the solicitor to write to her and eventually she would resume access. So no need to go to court. But then she'd repeat the stunt in another 6-8 weeks.
My point is this, you're ex has tried to deny access. It didn't work. Hopefully, no more court bs for you

 

[LovingDad1973]

"best interests of the child"
That is it - family law in 5 words. So no accusation that the kids were exposed to violence? No accusation that you were violent to them.

Mate those magistrates are pretty smart, they're gonna see this for what it is. Frankly, I think you're on a win here even if you accept without admission.
WHY? Well clearly ex wife is pissed with how the family law stuff went. She was quick to jump on board and use this to deny access. She is not gonna win, not a chance. So she will learn quickly that she can't play games here.

I had a mate, the ex would drop the kid off sometimes . Not always. They lived 5 hours apart. Her best joke, was to wait until he'd done the 2 1/2 drive to the meeting point then call and say NOT COMING.... So He'd done the drive for nothing... He would pay the solicitor to write to her and eventually she would resume access. So no need to go to court. But then she'd repeat the stunt in another 6-8 weeks.
My point is this, you're ex has tried to deny access. It didn't work. Hopefully, no more court bs for you

Thanks mate.

Funnily enough I insisted that a section be entered into the Family Court orders agreed with my ex-wife in Nov 2019 prohibiting physical punishment of our daughters. Now I appreciate that there are varying opinions on physical punishment of kids and I experienced it growing up as a child. However, I think it's counter productive and I have never as much as given one of our daughters a smack. I think that once someone resorts to violence (with a child or adult) then you have already lost the argument. To be then accused of perpetrating violence is absurd

The clause "Both parties be restrained on without admission as to needs basis from physically disciplining the children or permitting anyone else to do so."

My ex (when she was able to get legal aid) used to arrive at my house, try to initiate an argument with me (back then I was still hurting at the false accusations and not being able to see my children) and then hit me with a letter from her legal aid lawyer. This would happen on a weekly basis and it was costing me at least $400 each time to get a lawyer to reply. But two changes happened 1. When my ex would start her baiting I learned to just smile and wish her a nice day (first time I did that my ex-wife's head almost exploded) and 2. having read what my lawyer wrote in reply, I realised that I could write a response just as well as my lawyer.

Its a long hard slog but it does get easier. And I have learned from each court experience which is paying off in the magistrate seeing through the lies and bs.

I really appreciate the replies on here - it really helps.

 

[LovingDad1973]

Laws around FVRO's in WA have changed recently... The new law states that any person who applies for a FVRO MUST be granted an interim order. Ridiculous IMO... The result will be a huge backlog of cases to be heard by respondents who wish to oppose it..The COA is something that has been introduced as a way of allowing a respondent to accept without admissions & I believe differs a little from the former accepting without admissions

There seems to be a bit of conflicting opinion out there ATM whether a COA is considered a FVRO or not, at least one law firm states that a COA is specifically NOT a FVRO ( still is legally enforceable & breaches are punishable)... While legal aid states that they fall under the restraining orders act & therefore are...... You should get some solid legal opinion on that, if it is not a FVRO, that MAY mean that it doesn't have to be declared in the family court as a FVRO doe's... (again Check that with a solicitor)..

That said, the family court (federal circuit court) only states that any RELEVANT FVRO needs to be declared.. I can't see how this would be relevant to your family law case.. It's not about your ex & you have no history of FV with her that one could argue would make this FVRO relevant..

A COA can be made by the court on any terms & length of time it sees as appropriate in the circumstances... It's my understanding this can be challenged by the applicant (The terms & time that is) & a court date may be set to do that, BUT it's the COA that is in effect in the meantime not a FVRO....

Cheers Atticus.

Thats also my understanding of the change to granting of INTERIM FVRO's in WA - they are given as a matter of course. Then it's up to whether the respondent who can do nothing (after 21 days it becomes final) or challenges it, which I did only because it was being used by my ex-wife in Family Court.

My ex-girlfriend made a statement to the police in early April 2019 but they didn't get an FVRO out against me. They just interviewed me in early May 2019 and told me that no charges would be laid and that was an end of the matter from the police perspective. It wasn't until late May 2019 that my ex-girlfriend requested an FVRO, to assist my ex-wife in Family Court and get payback.

Does anyone know the difference between an INTERIM FVRO applied for by the police and one applied for by the alleged victim? I would have thought that if the police believed I was a danger to my ex-girlfriend then they would have applied for one when she made the statement to them?

 

[sammy01]

Police application means they believed there was grounds. 'Victim's applies means the cops were not interested so she had to apply to the courts directly. I'm thinking yours is the second.... that being the case I reckon challenging it... that said I liked my ago in the end. It kept the ex away

 

[LovingDad1973]

Police application means they believed there was grounds. 'Victim's applies means the cops were not interested so she had to apply to the courts directly. I'm thinking yours is the second.... that being the case I reckon challenging it... that said I liked my ago in the end. It kept the ex away

Yep thats what I thought. It was almost two months AFTER making a statement to the police that my ex-girlfriend applied for the INTERIM FVRO and I believe only then to assist my ex-wife in Family Court. She can't have been too worried about her safety for those two months, or for the almost 6 months between the alleged assault and the INTERIM FVRO.

And the police were pretty decent, advised me not to have anything more to do with my ex-girlfriend (easy because I finished with her in late Feb 2019) and drove me home after the interview. Tip. In such situations always be polite, courteous and compliant to the police and things will go better for you.

Thanks for the assistance sammy01