Admins/Moderators...not sure how much I'm allowed to reveal, so feel free to edit/remove any comments I've made that may overstep the rules.
First off, I'm writing this for people's opinion on what their experience/thoughts are, having gone through or is going through custody of chldren. It's purpose isn't for legal advice - though if any pointer(s) are offered, I won't be ungrateful. We do have a solicitor. I also won't be using any following comments in Court eg: 'but such and such wrote in such and such discussion', etc.
I'm looking for clarity/answers for myself, having never gone through anything like this before, and I'm quite frankly left bewildered, and can't find anyone to answer from a point of experience.
My son and his ex separated when their baby was 8 months old. The baby stayed with his mother, while our son moved back home with us. There was quite a bit of threats of withholding the child for the first few months from the ex and her father. It was also suggested by her solicitor to 'use the baby as leverage to get what you want'...as told to us by her.
At first, there was no set periods of contact. Son would ask for contact, and if there wasn't the threat of withholding, she would agree. The threat(s) would only last a day or two, then she'd agree and we'd have the baby over for whatever agreed time.
(Without looking up specific time periods, I'll just give rough guesstimates for examples). After about 1.5 months of this, they agreed to 1 week on, 1 week off. About 3 weeks after that decision, they agreed to 4-3/3-4 care.
Just before the 4-3/3-4 agreement, my son suggested to her to do mediation which she agreed to. He arranged it, then while waiting for their appointment, she said no, she wanted to go with a different mob, so she could have a solicitor with her. My son attended the one he arranged when the appointment came, she didn't. He also attended the one she arranged.
At the 2nd one, she dropped the times down by heaps for my son to see his son, and my son reluctantly agreed because he was veil-threatened by her solicitor that they could push for even less time, and because he worked, she would get it!
Meanwhile, our grandson would come to us (I say us because our son's living here, so naturally our grandson's coming here) filthy - clothes and body, and sometimes inappropriately dressed for the cold weather. Then he started showing up with bad nappy rash, all of this over a 5-6 month period. A diary and photos were kept of all this and submitted to the Family Court.
Then around June, he came with a small faded bruise on top of one of his ears. My wife didn't tell our son or me about this because she said it was too faded. She did try to get a photo, but it wouldn't show properly. A few weeks later, he came with a much darker bruise.
I won't write who my wife works for, or what her qualifications are, but she is qualified to be able to say this bruise was highly suspicious. We took photos and talked about our options, but knowing that my son's ex was very capable of having no hesitation withholding our grandson - based on previous actions on her part, and knowing her 'personality' like we do, for the purpose of still being able to keep an eye on grandson, we decided to err on the side of caution, and not mention anything to her, but agreed that if he showed up again with anything even remotely suspicious, we'd take appropriate action.
Well, he did show up again with bruising at the end of August last year - this was for my son's 2-night weekly access. Bruising was the same place, but this time much darker, and both ears...these bruises have always been roughly finger size, and always on the inner and outer top most part of the ear.
I took him to the local hospital - this is the same day he arrived here for the start of my son's access. Triage Nurse was suspicious, and said it'd need reporting. Then the doctor looked at him, he diagnosed as "Non-Accidental" injuries, and said he'd have to report it.
Two DOCS workers showed up the next day, and both also came to the same conclusion as the doctor that the bruising was "Non-Accidental". They determined that our now 16.5-month-old grandson would be safe in my son's full time care until such time as an investigation could be completed.
The next day - grandson was due to go back to his mother. My son sent her a text stating that due to the circumstances, he wouldn't be returning their son. A flood of text messages came back to my son with all kinds of threats and warnings. To my mind, written by her solicitor because she's incapable of pronouncing some of the words, let alone spell them! On advice from my wife and I, my son ignored her messages. We also sorted legal advice this day.
My son's ex served him with an application for Recovery Order just over a month later to appear 2 days later... She and her solicitor didn't even show, which irritated the Judge to no end. Her solicitor had to be tracked down by phone, so then it became an 'appearance by phone'.
The ex told DOCS one version of how the bruising happened, then told them a slightly different version. At Family Court, she wanted time to come up with another version, but the Judge told her no because she'd already given one!
When my wife and my son got to Court, they were also told that a note/letter/email (whatever) was there from the Crown's Solicitor's office requesting that my grandson remain in his father's care.
There were 6 or 7 Court dates all up. A couple ran out of time when the Judge wanted more info, so we went back again. The last was for the Interim Order. Also for the Interim hearing, there was an official letter from a doctor of an organisation that I would describe as a Forensic Team of children's injuries (not sure if allowed to use the organisation's name here), saying the injuries were "Non-Accidental", and that this doctor was prepared to stand up in Court stating that.
So in summary, we have - in order - my wife who's certified to recognise and investigate children's injuries, the Triage Nurse, the doctor, 2 DOCS workers, the DOCS workers' Manager (forgot to mention her, I took some photos to the case worker 4 days later, and she called her manager out who was surprised that the bruises were still so dark and evident after so many days had passed), the Crown's Solicitor's office request, the Judge stating at one hearing that the injuries were done on purpose (years of experience in Family Law), and then the Forensic Dr stating they were done on purpose.
So my question to any that would like to give their thought(s)...what would you expect/speculate the outcome of the Interim Order would be?
First off, I'm writing this for people's opinion on what their experience/thoughts are, having gone through or is going through custody of chldren. It's purpose isn't for legal advice - though if any pointer(s) are offered, I won't be ungrateful. We do have a solicitor. I also won't be using any following comments in Court eg: 'but such and such wrote in such and such discussion', etc.
I'm looking for clarity/answers for myself, having never gone through anything like this before, and I'm quite frankly left bewildered, and can't find anyone to answer from a point of experience.
My son and his ex separated when their baby was 8 months old. The baby stayed with his mother, while our son moved back home with us. There was quite a bit of threats of withholding the child for the first few months from the ex and her father. It was also suggested by her solicitor to 'use the baby as leverage to get what you want'...as told to us by her.
At first, there was no set periods of contact. Son would ask for contact, and if there wasn't the threat of withholding, she would agree. The threat(s) would only last a day or two, then she'd agree and we'd have the baby over for whatever agreed time.
(Without looking up specific time periods, I'll just give rough guesstimates for examples). After about 1.5 months of this, they agreed to 1 week on, 1 week off. About 3 weeks after that decision, they agreed to 4-3/3-4 care.
Just before the 4-3/3-4 agreement, my son suggested to her to do mediation which she agreed to. He arranged it, then while waiting for their appointment, she said no, she wanted to go with a different mob, so she could have a solicitor with her. My son attended the one he arranged when the appointment came, she didn't. He also attended the one she arranged.
At the 2nd one, she dropped the times down by heaps for my son to see his son, and my son reluctantly agreed because he was veil-threatened by her solicitor that they could push for even less time, and because he worked, she would get it!
Meanwhile, our grandson would come to us (I say us because our son's living here, so naturally our grandson's coming here) filthy - clothes and body, and sometimes inappropriately dressed for the cold weather. Then he started showing up with bad nappy rash, all of this over a 5-6 month period. A diary and photos were kept of all this and submitted to the Family Court.
Then around June, he came with a small faded bruise on top of one of his ears. My wife didn't tell our son or me about this because she said it was too faded. She did try to get a photo, but it wouldn't show properly. A few weeks later, he came with a much darker bruise.
I won't write who my wife works for, or what her qualifications are, but she is qualified to be able to say this bruise was highly suspicious. We took photos and talked about our options, but knowing that my son's ex was very capable of having no hesitation withholding our grandson - based on previous actions on her part, and knowing her 'personality' like we do, for the purpose of still being able to keep an eye on grandson, we decided to err on the side of caution, and not mention anything to her, but agreed that if he showed up again with anything even remotely suspicious, we'd take appropriate action.
Well, he did show up again with bruising at the end of August last year - this was for my son's 2-night weekly access. Bruising was the same place, but this time much darker, and both ears...these bruises have always been roughly finger size, and always on the inner and outer top most part of the ear.
I took him to the local hospital - this is the same day he arrived here for the start of my son's access. Triage Nurse was suspicious, and said it'd need reporting. Then the doctor looked at him, he diagnosed as "Non-Accidental" injuries, and said he'd have to report it.
Two DOCS workers showed up the next day, and both also came to the same conclusion as the doctor that the bruising was "Non-Accidental". They determined that our now 16.5-month-old grandson would be safe in my son's full time care until such time as an investigation could be completed.
The next day - grandson was due to go back to his mother. My son sent her a text stating that due to the circumstances, he wouldn't be returning their son. A flood of text messages came back to my son with all kinds of threats and warnings. To my mind, written by her solicitor because she's incapable of pronouncing some of the words, let alone spell them! On advice from my wife and I, my son ignored her messages. We also sorted legal advice this day.
My son's ex served him with an application for Recovery Order just over a month later to appear 2 days later... She and her solicitor didn't even show, which irritated the Judge to no end. Her solicitor had to be tracked down by phone, so then it became an 'appearance by phone'.
The ex told DOCS one version of how the bruising happened, then told them a slightly different version. At Family Court, she wanted time to come up with another version, but the Judge told her no because she'd already given one!
When my wife and my son got to Court, they were also told that a note/letter/email (whatever) was there from the Crown's Solicitor's office requesting that my grandson remain in his father's care.
There were 6 or 7 Court dates all up. A couple ran out of time when the Judge wanted more info, so we went back again. The last was for the Interim Order. Also for the Interim hearing, there was an official letter from a doctor of an organisation that I would describe as a Forensic Team of children's injuries (not sure if allowed to use the organisation's name here), saying the injuries were "Non-Accidental", and that this doctor was prepared to stand up in Court stating that.
So in summary, we have - in order - my wife who's certified to recognise and investigate children's injuries, the Triage Nurse, the doctor, 2 DOCS workers, the DOCS workers' Manager (forgot to mention her, I took some photos to the case worker 4 days later, and she called her manager out who was surprised that the bruises were still so dark and evident after so many days had passed), the Crown's Solicitor's office request, the Judge stating at one hearing that the injuries were done on purpose (years of experience in Family Law), and then the Forensic Dr stating they were done on purpose.
So my question to any that would like to give their thought(s)...what would you expect/speculate the outcome of the Interim Order would be?
