NSW Consent for overseas travel

[Mygirl07]

Hi there,

I have consent orders in place with my ex. The orders don’t cover overseas travel. My ex wants to take our daughter overseas but she won’t consent to me doing the same. I don’t want to be vindictive but I don’t think it’s fair to consent to her travel when she won’t consent to mine.
He would the court view this if we go to court if I withhold consent?

 

[AllForHer]

The Court would probably just order that you’re both allowed to travel provided you give each other notice and an itinerary.

Tell mum that you’ll consent to passport and travel conditional on agreement to include travel in the consent orders for both parents with 28 days notice and an itinerary, with the passport to be held by someone’s lawyer or another third party until the aforementioned conditions have been met.

If she doesn’t agree, no passport. Might seem vindictive, but provided neither is a flight risk, the Court would grant you both the freedom to travel, so let mum take it to Court if she wants and wind up with equal ability to travel.

 

[Mygirl07]

Thank you for your reply.
Travel is a small part of a much bigger issue.
All this back and forth and constant stress and arguing makes it easy to just give up.
I just want to be an important part of my daughters life but my girl is aligned to her Mum - further exacerbated by her mum’s constant denigrating of me and my family. Pretty sure it’s called “parental alienation” is the US.
It’s frustrating that lawyers represent people that clearly don’t want the best for their children.
It seems to me, despite the law, despite the all factors 50/50 is rarely (if ever) possible for Dads... just because their Dads. ☹️

 

[AllForHer]

Okay, stop.

Do you know what people love most about the phrase ‘parental alienation’? It means they get to pass the buck. They get to blame the other parent or the Court or the lawyers or the police for 100% of the problems, and they get to pretend they’re just a victim so they can escape without consequence and with pride in tact.

But the reason the Court doesn’t like the phrase ‘parental alienation’ in Australia is because it’s speculative, and it tells the Court that one parent doesn’t want to take any responsibility for the problems between them. You can’t expect equal care when you don’t want to take equal responsibility.

Now, my husband is just one of many fathers on this forum who has gained equal care or more by going to Court, and I believe you’ll find that not one of the people here who attained such an outcome ever once referred to ‘parental alienation’ in their Court documents. What we did instead was learn the system and learn how to play the game better. We learned how to make concessions for past mistakes, and started focusing on solutions.

If Mum refuses your very polite suggestion to negotiate a parenting plan that allows either party to travel once conditions of notice and itinerary are met, then advise her that you’re sorry that you can’t agree and if she changes her mind, you’re happy to discuss, but in the meantime, if she needs someone to look after the child while she’s away, you are able to do so. Don't argue about it, don't enter the back-and-forth, don't respond when she's pushing your buttons. If your child passes on her mum's complaints to you, you say 'That's an adult issue that your mum and I are working out, it's not something you need to stress over'.

Remember: you don't have to enter every argument that you're invited into.

 

[Mygirl07]

That’s great advice. And sometimes I agree I need to stop and be put back in my box and stop being having a victim mentality.
I’ve read a lot on the subject and I never talk negatively about mum in front of my daughter. Mum on the other hand is actively denigrating me, every opportunity she has. If Mum is around (day at the shops) and I bump into my daughter, she pretends she doesn’t see me. But is totally different when Mum in not around.
I am always polite and courteous to Mum despite her constantly baiting me, because I see that she is trying to push my buttons. I guess I’m just sick of every little thing being an argument as opposed to Mum just being fair and a good human being for our daughters sake.
I currently have 4/9 shared care and half holidays - but i’d really like to see my girl more and have her more involved with me as my family so she has the opportunity to have me as an equal positive influence on her life.

 

[Mygirl07]

Can you elaborate on this...”What we did instead was learn the system and learn how to play the game better. We learned how to make concessions for past mistakes, and started focusing on solutions.”?

 

[Tim W]

Depends which country and for what purpose.
A week in Bali with extended family in school holidays might be looked at one way,
but a plan to remove the child back to the ancestral village in a third world country
might be looked at quite differently.

 

[sammy01]

So I'm assuming you're not super rich... That is why you want advice from punters like us..
Tasmania in Summer and Darwin in winter..
OR the snowfields... All good locations.

Over seas... Forget it. Not worth it.
Story time... She agreed, I organised passports. A week in Fiji.... But the passports had to go to her house as she was primary carer.... Once the passports arrived, she had second thoughts... She knew it had all been paid for, hotels, flights etc etc... But she had lots of fun... Told me it was off, told me she'd think about it. blah blah... Now we did go and it was great... But the grief.... Even 48 hours out I was not certain and frankly, the thought of going without the kids.... I'd decided I'd stay in AU rather than spend a week in Fiji on my own....

Don't go there.
So holiday within Australia. OR spend a fortune going to court for permission to travel.
where about's in NSW are you? I'm guessing Sydney? Go to the snow... OR go to the far north... Mate, it isn't about the location.... IT is about the time you spend with the kid.

 

[Mygirl07]

Depends which country and for what purpose.
A week in Bali with extended family in school holidays might be looked at one way,
but a plan to remove the child back to the ancestral village in a third world country
might be looked at quite differently.

Thanks for the reply. Yeah only Hague countries.

 

[SamanthaJay]

My partner has had a similar response from his child's mother. He could go to court but he's already spent enough time and money there with more to come and Sammy's right about Australia, the wonderful country we already live in. It has many beautiful places to visit. My partner used to take his family overseas every year. I don't think the kids even really appreciate the fact that they've led a very privileged life in that respect. So we are going to the other side of Australia instead and the mother has no say or control and that suits him just fine.